.358 Norma or .35 Whelen - 24hourcampfire THe 35 whelen did have a little more power than the 358. If the .350 Rigby Magnum was effective in the golden era of safari, modern premium bullet designs will make it even better. DoubleTap loads the 180-grain Barnes TTSX bullet at 3100 fps, and the 225-grain Swift A-Frame at 3000 fps, giving options to the hunter who wants the most versatility from their big-game rifle. Every time I use it I ask myself, Whats not to like? Beats me, but nobody liked it enough to keep it in production. I have one, and I like it a lot. zero-we see that contrary to popular belief, a 35-caliber can be a long-range cartridge. Have a .350 Rem Mag, building a .358 Win currently, would prefer to do the .358 Norma if possible but not sure if this action can handle it.Anyone? Everybody agrees that the .358 Win. of muzzle energy. Ive obviously left the door wide open. Faster 6.5sthe new 6.5 PRC, the old .264, or the super-fast .26 Nosler and 6.5-300 Weatherbywill deliver more energy and open the range envelope a bit. All Petersen's Hunting subscribers now have digital access to their magazine content. The cartridge is closely related to the .308 Norma Magnum. Is there a way to find out what year it is by serial #? I'm looking for a simpler project on this one. Publisher of Petersen's HUNTING magazine, Kevin Steele is at the Steiner Optics booth with Alberto Corbetta to discuss the Predator 4 and Predator 8. Blocker Outdoors Finisher gloves, headcovers and other accessories are available in Mossy Oak Bottomland and Mossy Oak Obsession NWTF camouflage patterns to match various turkey hunting terrain. Think of the .358 Norma Magnum as the chunky cousin of the .338 Winchester Magnum; not quite as svelte or popular, but equally effective in a fight. I believe in quality optics, but quality and magnification are not synonymous. People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. In fact, the recoil of the .358 Norma Magnum, at about 35 ft. lbs. Of course, not all .35-caliber cartridges approach greatness. At 300 yards, it has 19 percent more energy than the .300 Win. Here are the features to watch out for. Kynoch was a big producer of .350 ammo, but that has ceased in the recent past. The ammunition situation is a little better than the rifles. Not only that, many different bullet moulds were made for casting .358 bullets in some of the most fanciful shapes. The .35 Win., .35 Newton and .350 Griffin & Howe Mag. From the Green Goblin (a bolt-action rifle I built on a Remington action), both will produce groups that are sub-minute-of-angle. The .351 WSL did grab a bit of fame, first as a popular rifle for prison guards and then as one of the rifles used to punch a lot of holes in Bonnie and Clydes automobile (although that accolade is in question). Sure, we experiment a bit with other bore sizes, but in the end it always comes back to the .30 caliber. Somehow, years ago, I got the notion that it is not prudent to be opening the bolt face of a 700 from standard (270W) to magnum (358N). So when it comes to penetrating thick hide and heavy bone, one could see where the .350 Rigby could benefit from a heavier bullet, say a premium 250-grain with a SD of .279. The bullet was the then-new Trophy Bonded 250-grain Bear Claw. The .356 Win. Since then, I have often recommended medium bores, such as Elmer Keiths favorite .33s, and Ive used the 8mm Remington Magnum a lot. Another vote for something different.The 358 STA would be the one. Posts: 46,063. Twenty years ago, I might have said .338 Winchester Magnum was the perfect choice for elk. Here in North America, you could take the .350 Rigby anywhere youd take the .35 Whelen or .358 Norma Magnum, and that includes north to Alaska for the great bears. In 1987 Remington made an honest cartridge out of the .35 Whelen. Thought about that 375 Ruger but nah. Hunting Shack .35 Whelen N/A Centerfire Rifle Ammo I am also looking at building a 358 Norma Mag on a model 110 Savage action, formerly a 300 Win mag, and start from scratch with the stock ( bedding and pillar) and make it a tolerable shooter even if a bit heavy. The norma would cost more if I had to open the bolt face. While the Colt Model 601 was the first AR-15 to be mass-produced, there were several design variations that came before during the platform's development. There are specialized situations where close shots are the norm, but most often, the ideal elk rifle should have enough versatility for shots out to 300 yards and change. It can work in close or at a distance or dazzle you with footwork. I did kill a ton of squirels with pistol bullets and a little 700X, it would shoot little cloverleafs at 50 yrds. None of this can be said for either the .338 Winchester Magnum or the .375 H&H. I have long been something of a .35 caliber fan, but I have to admit that I believe the reason for the general lack of public acceptance of all but the least powerful .35's is, in a word, recoil. For more specialized uses, Speer makes a 180-grain flatpoint (semispitzer)that, with reduced loads, turns the .358 Norma Magnum into a pussycat for recoil but is easily capable of handling game such as black bears and white-tailed deer out to 250 yards or so. While most of the .35 caliber rifle cartridges are powerful medium bore numbers designed for use on large (CXP3) game like elk and moose, the most popular .35 caliber rifle cartridge is the .35 Remington. Then come the .270s. Ruger made a few bolt-actions some years back, and Remington made rifles in the 700 Classic line, but they are long gone. Powered by UBB.threads PHP Forum Software 7.7.5. Mention the Rigby name to any rifle aficionado, and odds are that the famous .416 Rigby cartridge will come quickly to mind, and with good reason; it is an undeniable classic. Then come the .30s, and now were talking business. Kali Parmley, Editor-in-chief of Bakccountry Hunter speaks with Bret Maffet of Franchi Firearms to discuss the all new Momentum All Terrain Elite. Follow along to see exactly how. On those gray, moody November days when I am feeling blue I take my Remington Model 141 pump-action rifle in .35 Rem. I am not into the current long-range fad, especially on powerful animals like elk. .358 STA - RifleShooter The .358 Win. It, as you know, can be loadeddown to be a 35 Whelen but the reverse is not true. The big issue with the .350 Rigby Magnum is the lack of available ammunition. Frankly, I would not want to be without them. To reach the .300 mark, youd need a 270-grain bullet (the North Fork and Woodleigh bullets come immediately to mind), but stabilization becomes an issue in the slower twists, and thats long been a problem in .35-caliber barrels. I could get brass easy from each by forming parent cases, 308 and 30-06. Re: 35 whelen vs 358 norma mag vs 9.3 x 62, Powered by UBB.threads PHP Forum Software 7.7.5. I was wrong. a good brush buster and good to 300 yards. The long accepted story was that James V. Howe developed the cartridge in 1922 and named it in honor of his friend, gunwriter Col. Townsend Whelen. The guide professed to be dumbstruck: I never saw a nilgai knocked down like that, he said, And we use some big rifles here!. I see no reason to shy away from it. At the same time, it will do almost everything the .375 will but with vastly more versatility. The origins of the .35 Whelen are controversial even today. Remington loads a 200-grain PSP Core-Lokt bullet at a muzzle velocity of 2775 f.p.s. Looking for previous installments of our "Behind the Bullet" series? Thanks for any thoughts. These include some of my favorites, such as the .358 Winchester and .45-70. It put an exclamation point on that lung shot. Powders such as IMRs Trail Boss, Accurates 5744 and IMRs discontinued SR-4759 all work with lighter bullets, and sometimes accuracy is very good, even if the gas seal is not. As it was released in the first century of the . Tried and true. So it is fair to say that, over the years, .35 caliber rifles at least have caught the interest of the gun and ammo manufacturers, if not the general shooting public. That load actually produced 2825 f.p.s. The 358 Norma is a sure mag round, but expensive ammo and brass. But there is no compelling reason to consider a caliber larger than .35. .358 Norma brass is a snap to make from 338 Win Mag brass. Size aside, American elk are very tough creatures. Behind the Bullet: .350 Rigby Magnum - An Official Journal Of The NRA And the hunter must have full confidence in his or her choice. . Ill bet its been awhile since those cartridges have been seen in a hunting camp. Customer experience was, and still is, the primary focus, a key to the firms longevity and success. Bottles & 12-oz. Im voting no. Remington currently lists a Model 7 rifle with a 20-inch barrel; todays version of the 600 in .350 Rem. Most Professional Hunters agree that a bullet with a S.D. .470 Nitro Express. and the 6.5 mm Rem. Looks like I'll do a Whelen. .35 caliber rifle cartridges have been around practically forever without ever really becoming popular. Short of a wounded elephant or Cape buffalo in thick cover, there is no game I can think of for which you could not concoct a load in the .358. Any desire to hunt African dangerous game with your medium bore? A 358Norma is a good fit for this action. with a similar 180-grain bullet. Mag., and I think thats the only current production rifle in that cartridge. With a 200-grain bullet the .35 Whelen actually shoots a bit flatter than the .30-06 Sprg. I have a .356 Win. On a 600 pound animal like a big bull elk the optimum game range of the .308 (180 grain bullet at a MV of 2610 fps) is a useful 175 yards. I will go with the 35 Whelen BUT 9.3x62 will be cool due that you already have a 350 Rem mag, if you're opening the bolt face the 358 STA better option than Norma and 338-06 could be a nice choice too. Spl. The .318 Westley Richards was a highly popular choice at that time, and it drives a 250-grain bullet of .330-inch diameter, with a SD of 0.328, and the .375 Holland & Holland uses a 300-grain bullet of nominal diameter with a SD of 0.305; both are renowned for their penetration. So are the .350 Remington Magnum and .358 Norma Magnum. The sad truth is that the active list of current .35-caliber rifles and cartridges is tragically short. There is certainly no lack of .358-inch diameter bullets to choose from but brass is limited. Remington continues to offer factory ammo, and its 200-grain factory load has a muzzle velocity of 2675 f.p.s., while the 250-grain loads muzzle velocity is 2400 f.p.s. This was not the factory bullet from the 1960s, with its mild-steel jacket, but a later one. When chambered for cartridges such as the .243 Win., 6 mm Rem., .308 Win. .358 Norma N/A Centerfire Rifle Ammo For Sale at Classic Firearms Mystery of the .358 Winchester - CHUCKHAWKS.COM Not necessarily top dollar everything. The "U.S. Rifle, Caliber .30, Model of 1903," better-known as the M1903 Springfield, has become one of the most popular U.S. military small arms to collect. That load has a maximum optimal range on 1000 pound game (like a big Alaskan moose or brown bear) of 151 yards. Its often thought that if they had it would have gained popularity over the .338 Win. Released in 1959though there were no factory chambered rifles or factory loaded ammunition available for the new cartridgeNorma offered chamber reamers and new component brass for its new brainchild. Give a Gift The .308 Winchester is a fine elk cartridge, and the grand old .30-06, with a bit more velocity and energy, is better. Kevin Steele from Petersen's HUNTING speaks to Jordan Egli of Burris Optics about the all-new Veracity PH Riflescope. In the shooting sports we call that reaction recoil or "kick." There are places where .22 centerfires are legal for elk. Many western hunters annually take elk with 6mms and .25s. A medium variable in the 3-9X or 2.5-10X range should be enough scope for elk hunting. SAUM and .300 WSM, with their 180 grain bullets at a MV of 2960-2970 fps, have an optimum range of about 120 yards on 1000 pound animals. The .358 Norma established its reputation in high-end hunting rifles like this Schultz & Larsen Model 65DL. Of the three, only the .358 Norma has not become a standard chambering. Any of these will handle just about any big game one might hunt with a .358 Norma, where you want to employ its ample knockdown power. And, as any fan of the .35-caliber cartridges knows, there are quite a few bullet weights to choose from within the caliber. It arrived with three other cartridges designed to compete with Winchesters popular lever-action lineup. The .358 Norma Mag. 35 whelen vs 358 norma mag vs 9.3 x 62 - 24hourcampfire Sometimes you get a point-blank shot; other times you need to stretch it a bit farther. Even so, most experienced deer hunters have pretty good ideas on appropriate rifles. .35 Whelen: The Poor Man's Magnum - Big Game Hunting Blog Why the .35 Rem. As it turned out, having a great punch was not enough for either one. So we see that even with a one pound lighter rifle, the .358 recoils slightly less than a .300 magnum. i have a 35 whelen and love it. Just have it rebarreled to 9.3X62, and you will have a 358 Norma with five in the magazine! The 338/06 when compared to the .35 Whelen only beats it with the lighter bullets and not by much. You bet they worked! The writings of Robert Ruark certainly helped the reputation of the cartridge and the company, as Ruark put his young PH Harry Selby and the .416 Rigby rifle he carried on a pedestal. Mag. Not so the .358 Norma. Elk bullets must be tough enough to provide adequate penetration. In 1965 Remington took it to the next level with the introduction of the Model 600 Magnum Carbine. There werent many factory .358 Norma Magnum rifles mademost were Husqvarnas or Schultz & Larsensbut many American gunsmiths converted the Mauser 98, Springfield 03-A3 and the like to the big .35, as it made an absolutely perfect choice for those headed north to Alaska. can drive the same weight bullet a bit faster. It was verry expensive to shoot, lots of powder and expensive bullets and brass. Likewise, so do experienced western elk hunters. They truly were ahead of their time, as they were short magnums back when being a short magnum wasnt cool. Among the .35 caliber cartridges popular in the United States, the .358 offered a definite step up in performance; the .35 Remingtonthat popular woods rifleis much slower than the .358, and though the .35 Whelen has been among us since 1922, it would remain a wildcat until 1988. I have shot a few critters, including a tough South Texas Nilgai, and have been happy with the performance. The .35 Whelen is a necked up medium bore wildcat cartridge that was created by necking up a .30-06 Springfield case which is famously overpowered for the 30-caliber bullet it propels. Out of stock View Details . Publisher Kevin Steele is in the Beretta booth with Logan Killam, the Shotgun Product Manager, to discuss the all new Beretta A300 Ultima Turkey. Griffin & Howe developed the semiwildcat .350 G&H based on the .375 H&H case, as well as pioneering the .35 Whelen. Moving down a notch and comparing the .35 Whelen (250 grain bullet at a MV of 2400 fps) to the .30-06 (220 grains at 2410 fps), which have nearly identical case capacity, we find that the optimum game range (OGW) on 1000 pound animals is 10 yards for the .30-06 and 100 yards for the .35 Whelen. Mag. .35 Caliber Cartridges - CHUCKHAWKS.COM Quite a difference! I have one, of course, and it is fun to shoot, but I would never use it on a serious big-game hunt. We owe a debt of gratitude to the engineers at the British firm of Holland & Holland; though it is lost to history who exactly designed the belted magnum cartridge, the .275 and .375 Holland & Holland Magnums were game changers. .358 Winchester: King Of The .35 Calibers - Gun Digest There is only .007-inch (seven thousandths) difference between the .270s .277-inch bullet and the 7mms .284-inch bullet. The .358 has 24 percent more energy at the muzzle than the .300 Win. But have owned multiple 9.3s and Whelens. In addition, for stopping the big predators of the world, it's hard to beat a suitable .35 caliber rifle. That does not mean that any gunsmith who had his own ideas about velocity and accuracy might not include it or go completely the other way. Throw a belt on the .35 Newton and you couldnt tell the difference three feet away. That list, by the way, is in ascending order of power. I'm sending my 270 tikka off to JES rebore to get it punched out to 35 whelen. These were, primarily, the Schultz & Larsen (Denmark), the Husqvarna (Sweden) and a few Browning High Powers made by FN in Belgium. Though still under construction, Im eager to take the classic cartridge into the hunting fields. He never questioned the adequacy of his .270 for elk, nor do I, but he was also a lifelong .30-06 fan and privately conceded its superiority for elk-sized game. Also, the 35 Whelen will not do much that your 350 and 358 already do, if anything. Thinking of a medium bore with a bit of thump.9.3 x 62 holds some exotic mystique for me being its use on African large game but I am thinking realistically .366 cant be that much of an advantage over .358 can it? But perhaps youre not after thick-skinned dangerous game. The 35 whelen and 358 winchester were the two I was torn between. Synthetic wins over laminate because laminates, strongest of all, are also heaviest. I wont go so far as to say thats foolish, but theres a major difference in size and toughness between a cow or spike and a mature bull. At 300 yds., the .358 Norma impacts only 0.96" lower than the .300 Win. Movement is more random in big country. the problem in this debate is we are crossing over in calibres, which means thrust on different sized pistons. The .270 WSM and .270 Weatherby deliver more energy, but all three are fine. Out of stock View Details . Winchester and Hornady both offer 200-grain loads at 2475 f.p.s. My 8mm Remington Magnum was stocked in dense walnut and had a long barrel. Theres also a mindset difference. is still not burning up the sales records, so maybe ahead of its time is the wrong description. By and large, we shooters seem to gravitate to the middle of the road; to bland, yet predictable, mediocrity. 35 whelen vs 358 norma mag vs 9.3 x 62 - 24hourcampfire The bullet went in behind the near shoulder, struck the far shoulder from the inside, and the blue bull hit the ground with a thud. Most were intended for .38-caliber handguns, but any bullet made for either the .38 Special or .357 Magnum can be loaded and shot in the .358 Norma Magnum with varying degrees of success. I am convinced there are better tools, and theres also that matter of mindset. and a 250-grain Partition load with a muzzle velocity of 2550 f.p.s. was initially chambered in Remingtons Model 8 autoloader, soon followed by the Model 14 pump-action. From a 12 twist bore, accuracy sweet spots for light bullets include 2950fps with 180 grain bullets, 2925fps with 200 grain bullets, before normalizing with 225 grain bullets at 2900fps. Oklahoma. It has never failed me. The .358 is vastly underated as the Whelen. Mag. and .32 Rem. During the spring conservation order, you can hunt with outfitters from Arkansas to Saskatchewan. Publisher, Kevin Steele is with Brett Marquardt from Streamlight Inc. discussing the new Streamlight Pro Tac 2.0, the latest edition in the Pro Tac series. Lyman lists 47 different moulds that were available at one time or another, ranging in bullet weight from 70 to 282 grains. While the American mainstream wont accept the .35, they are not unloved. 5 Forgotten .35-Caliber Cartridges. Are They Doomed? - Field & Stream Subscriber Services. Contributor Brad Fenson takes to the grill, to cook up some delicious venison burgers. The .350 Remington Magnum is the only cartridge that appears on both lists of current and obsolete calibers. With todays interest in long-range shooting, big scopes are in, but powerful scopes add weight. Our editors have hand-picked these essential pieces of gear to make you a more successful hunter when you hit the game trails this season. Compare the Queen of the .35's, the .350 Remington Magnum--the original short (.308 length) magnum cartridge--with the new generation of short action magnums. That is quite a few cartridges considering that there is not a single best selling rifle cartridge in the bunch. The 6.5mm Creedmoor and the old 6.5x55 are sound minimal choices, adequate to 300 yards. Boltface would have to be altered for the Norma. I was used to the 30-06 parent cases (.270, 25-06, etc) so that is what I decided on. 358 Win vs 35 Whelen | Graybeard Outdoors and is a good cartridge for hunting the thick woods for deer, hogs, black bear or even elk. lbs. The .357 Magnum is ideal for light game like javelina and will do for the smaller species of deer and antelope at short range. 358 norma mag is a rarer bird but as I understand fire forming 300 win mag brass an easy way to feed it. Your rifle is your most important hunting tool, and knowing how to properly clean and store it when hunting season comes to a close is critical in keeping it in tip-top shape. Let's also compare the .358 with the other end of the spectrum. Enough Gun: Elk Stopping Power - Petersen's Hunting Kevin Steele of Petersen's HUNTING is with Dawn Wehunt of Rock River Arms INC. learning about the new Ascendant platform. This raises the obvious question: Why, with so many modern cartridges around of more or less equal power, chambered in readily available rifles, is there this lingering interest in, and loyalty to, the .358 Norma? In any mass-production rifle, either the .375 or .338, or both, will be found as a standard chambering. The .358 in a bolt-action rifle with a good scope is as accurate as any hunting cartridge available. You get the shot you get, and within sensible limits, you must be able to take the shot offered. All Rights Reserved. The .35 Rem. The .35 Whelen is accurate, hits hard, penetrates deep, shoots flat and recoils mildly. figure of 0.300 is desirable, and comparing similar cartridges, youll see the .350 Rigby comes in a bit behind the other popular choices of the day. Released in 1908, the .350 Rigby Magnum is an entirely original design, with no parent cartridge. Today we have better bullets than when I was a kid. Trust me, you could do worse, but youll be hard-pressed to do better! That being said, with much wider availability, and the higher . Norma offers factory ammunition, E.R. As many hunters know, the Remington Model 600 carbine, which was introduced in 1964, was one of the first short, light, bolt-action rifles to find success with deer hunters. So are the .350 Remington Magnum and .358 Norma Magnum. into the deer woods, and I pine for what could have been. In more recent times, the 1994 release of the .450 Rigby gave dangerous game hunters a bit more bullet weight than the .416 Rigby and has developed a small but devout following among both professional hunters and their clients alike. has been offered in just about every rifle action type ever conceived and a few handguns. By coincidence, in that same year, Norma Projektilfabrik of Sweden introduced its own heavyweight champion, the .358 Norma Magnum. In cartridges, as in boxing, what goes on behind the scenes often determines the outcome. PerH AH fanatic Joined May 8, 2021 Messages 536 Reaction score 813 Location Norway Articles 2 Jun 4, 2021 #5
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