and build quality is also excellent. The world's largest high-end audio community. list the Rockna Wavedream Edition sounds this good, how good does their As a matter of fact, I'd appreciate getting your impressions. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates. Too objective for subjectivists; too subjective for objectivsts. It's UPDATE VIDEO THREE for the Chord Electronics DAVE DAC REVIEW I have spent a lot more time with the DAVE Dac, still using. Is it too hot to touch? For some folk, a highly resolving and accurate system may well be described as being over-analytical, and on the other side of the audio fence, some will suggest that some systems sound nice but flawed. Couldn't agree more. Chord Dave Black New The Prime DAC With two prime DACs, MSB yields an unprecedented level of detail, reproducing the musicality, soundstage, and texture of an original performance, bringing the artist to you Ps Audio Directstream Dac Vs Auralic Vega Founded in 2004, Games for Change is a 501(c)3 nonprofit that empowers game creators and . Euphony Summus, EtherRegen, MSB Discrete. luxury apartment hotels paris. Along with an integrated clock, changing this card allows switching between single-ended and balanced outputs. https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/a-dac-that-crushes-price-vs-performance-ratio. Is it better than the Chord DAVE that I raved about a few years ago? You must log in or register to reply here. Anyway, the little bit of extra detail on the strings, the attack, and decay are all there to be heard and its a marvelous thing to listen to. Whats Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. Once you start playing a tune the DAC works out the sample rate and chooses the correct playback clock. I have heard a lot of top DACs at shows or other systems but not in my own. Yeah, you and me both- the look I got wasn't as funny as the one I got from the Sennheiser stand when I asked if they had any HD600 or HD650, instead of all those Momentums and so forth, but still. Not a bad idea Snoop! Focal Utopia ~ LCD i4 ~ ETHER FLOW open/C ~ LCD-2.2/XC ~ Nighthawk ~ K10 custom ~ JH Angie, Chord mscaler // Chord TT2 // Oppo PM-1 (Artisan silver headphone cable) // Beyerdynamic DT880 600 Ohm // WAVE Stream bnc cables // Kef LS50 Meta. It's pretty funny how everyone gives their personal pet recommendation with the utmost confidence that the buyer will like it. Specifications: Type: Digital to analogue converter with volume control. Please specify coaxial S/PDiF or optical S/PDiF. By clicking links on our site, we may earn affiliate commission, but our editorial remains entirely independent and unbiased. Rori is definitely welcome. Wherever I read I see unanimous praise for the MSB Select II. If you take a look at their website you will see that the machining shop is a fully equipped facility designed to meet the needs of a company producing high-quality cases in which the electronics will be fitted no off the shelf or cheap bent metal cases here! I'm looking for suggestions on DACs I should listen to as possible replacement of my Chord Dave. Rori there are others I know about but Ive not heard them recently. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Much appreciated. It may not display this or other websites correctly. You could try some of the newer dacs that has gotten good reviews. Its headphone amplifier is good but no match for higher powered units. Yes, definitely, as it is those extra tiny little bits of detail that adds the cherry on top of an already rather splendid slice of musical cake brought out on tracks like the audio show mainstay Keith Dont Go from Acoustic Live by Nils Lofgren. What didn't you like about the Dave? And now that my system is much more resolving, it's possible that the differences could be larger and my preferences could change. Cs | Critical Mass CS2s -> components, Isoacoustics -> speakers + subs | Adona Eris II rack on Herbie's titanium footers | Fully treated and dedicated 2 channel room. The AC modules are fully balanced at every stage, have no buffers, IV converters, or transistors in the signal path, and have no active devices used in the conversion process at all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites. For such a high entry price I wouldn't take the gamble to go on some recommendation by a stranger whose tastes I don't know. I suppose what Im saying (badly) is that the Discrete was true to the file it was being fed and I did enjoy hearing it allowed me to pull small details out of the mix Jazz at the Pawn Shop (DSD128) felt more lifelike and in the room than I am used to and raw tracks such as Phutures Acid Trax did sound rougher and really basically recorded. I don't want to waste hifi shops time too much knowing I'll be going second hand either. Too many DACs> Too many amps> Too many headphones. There is no dark magic involved. Playing Gil Scott-Heron and Brian Jacksons Your Daddy Loves You from the Winter in America album gave me the same impression of a reach-out-and-touch soundscape with incredibly well-defined positions in the mix and a whole load of detail the over-driven sound of the electric piano at around a minute forty really stood out as being faithful to the recording; a case of high-fidelity highlighting a low-fidelity artefact? What makes you want to upgrade from DAVE? Fixed. I wanted to know for anyone who has heard it have you also heard a DAC that approached it in sonic performance? For the most part, I used this input and for a quick comparison one of the optical inputs. You must log in or register to reply here. I called the distributor and we went through everything again. Our digital testing has been done over the last 20 + years connection to the dac chip. The good DS (delta sigma) dacs that aren't hard or harsh, are a bit of a yawn, and lack bringing out the life (boogie factor) of the music, but in a . I just heard DAVE directly connected to MacBook Pro via USB without any expensive cables, headphone amplifier, power conditioner. You absolutely can say that you prefer other DAC's to the Berkeley Alpha Reference. Aurender N10 is still not a USB only dedicated streamer so you will not hear what USB audio is fully capable off through Ms/Dave. I wired it all up and the unit lit up but I could get no sound out of it whatsoever. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. personal preference. And I've learned to be careful and not generalize how a component will sound based on show conditions or other systems. What is available on models higher up the MSB food chain is the ability to add an analogue module so that you can use the unit as a true preamplifier and DAC. However, its also very nice to listen to in this system, though I would say it is more accurate/true to the original DAC than our LAB12 DAC or perhaps our Lampizator BIG 7. We have what I consider to be a pretty resolving system, but we also listen to music a fair old bit for pure pleasure and so theres a valve amp currently feeding our chosen reference loudspeakers though thats not to say this system isnt highly resolving in its own right. The demo model came in brushed aluminium but you can also get black. Chord Dave vs Mola Mola Makua/Tambaqui vs Emm Labs Dac2x vs Rockna Wavedream IGNORED Chord Dave vs Mola Mola Makua/Tambaqui vs Emm Labs Dac2x vs Rockna Wavedream . "OK, it would be. Would I pay extra for the second supply? Watts is avidly not reading this in anticipation of the video version he won't watch. By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies. Main Menu Analogue Volume Control 1dB from 0 to 106 Deactivable by menu, Dimensions ChassisWidth : 432 mmDepth: 305 mmHeight without feet: 51 mm. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. CHORD Dave could be the most expensive deeply design DAC in the world and if you find it not your taste there is the best off the shelf DACs like akm4499 in Topping D90 for 699$ that could be even better than Dave. With the MSB there has been a great deal of attention paid to ensuring the signal stays as pure as possible and is not affected by other parts of the DAC or outside sources; modular construction, dual power supplies, isolation of USB etc. That's the negative to going my route I guess. The Prime DAC Module. They're very back ordered and are a pro unit with balanced only outputs and no remote but oh my do they sound spectacular. Put simply, your DAC is ready for the future. The only true way for the end user to know what they prefer is through listening in their own system.. The end users ears are the only ears that count. Over the air updates will ensure that your renderer always has the latest capabilities and ultimate convenience. You're very polite about how you describe your preferences, cmarin. Of the ones you mentioned I'd be most tempted by the Emm Labs DAC 2x though if you can get a used higher-end Esoteric, you should jump on it. Point 75 EmmLab Dac2 I paid 9K$ for this on 2010. This is the main advantage of DAVE (i.e. If you go reference you will never look back. I own the MSB Select II with the dual powerbases and 33 Femto Clock. Daedalus Audio Apollo 11's. REL S3/SHO. However, to get this level of separation and detail within the soundscape the DAC is clearly having a very important role to play. the Select II pushes the analog to be its best. Well, you may not have heard a lot of high-end DAC's in your system, but the one's you've listed are pretty darned good. Unfortunately not, I'm going the second hand route as I've done with most of my setup. The MSB simply sounded more real to my ears and offered a more convincing soundstage and tonality and all the tiny informations in the music where integrated in the musical flow whereas the DAVE simply sounded flat and not realistic to my ears and even lacked those tiny informations. It is my name after all! Of those, I've only heard the DAVE. Then we have the Integrated Clock module and Im starting to get the whole modular approach to the design of the MSB DAC. I'm looking for suggestions on DACs I should listen to as possible replacement of my Chord Dave. Australian Business Number 38 650 151 296, Digital Sources, DACs, and Computer Audio, Chord Dave vs Mola Mola Makua/Tambaqui vs Emm Labs Dac2x vs Rockna Wavedream. As I listen to this tune a few times it strikes me that the Discrete is just that (discrete), it doesnt seem to add a great deal of itself to the file it is playing. MSB Technology [Select DAC II Full Option] Chord [Dave] Myek [Manhattan II] I had A-B test about 2 months. I have great synergy in my system and see no reason to listen to every new DAC out there. The DAVE DAC does not perform anywhere near where it should. The SQ is amazingly good. Ultimately, reducing noise in a system or improving room acoustics can have a bigger effect. Funny how Rob Watts drones on and on about noise modulation, and then we see his product performing like this.. now one might not exactly call this noise modulation, but it definitely something to avoid, especially given the price tag. With two prime DACs, we yield an unprecedented level of detail, reproducing the musicality, soundstage, and texture of an original performance, bringing the artist to you. This hobby is "highly subjective", influenced by personal feelings, tastes, or opinions; therefore you can A/B a million different components and come to a completely different conclusion on how it sounds compared to another listener. Whats Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. Besides that the MSB looks so much better. And I make Best DAC Quality Ranking list. If you have a turntable, for instance, the Discrete will have to act as a standalone DAC and go into a preamplifier/integrated amplifier which will then add its own flavour to the mix. dCS Bartok>Chord DAVE>MSB discrete discreteR2R R2R DAVE BartokdCSBartok Cheers @Stereophilus But the majority of the time all 6 of I'm looking for suggestions between $10K - $12K. Dedicated Line DSD/DXD | Audirvana+ | iFi iDSD Nano | SET Tube Amp | Totem Mites, Surround: VLC | M-Audio FastTrack Pro | Mac Opt | Panasonic SA-HE100 | Logitech Z623, DIY: SET Tube Amp | Low-Noise Linear Regulated Power Supply | USB, Power, Speaker Cables | Speaker Stands | Acoustic Panels, You need to be a member in order to leave a comment. That's just too money for the performance. In that time, weve pushed the industry forward with each product weve built, redefining whats possible. CH Precision mono dac with clock and 3 power supplies (7 boxes)----its more spendy---$150k, Merging Technologies NADAC w/power supply and clock---much better now with the clock and power supply upgrades than my previous experience.----around $60k. The video cannot be shown. With two prime DACs, the MSB Discrete yields an unprecedented level of detail that reproduces the musicality, soundstage and texture of an original performance, bringing the artist to you. Toggle signature. Founded in 2010 Whats Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. They are excellent pairing. SoundLab A1Px's, ARC REF40, VTL Siegfired II, cj GAT2, cj ART, DCS Vivaldi 2.0 stack, Taiko Audio SGM Extreme, TechDas AF1+ , Graham Phamtom III, Sumiko Palo Santos, vdH Black Beauty, ARC Phono 3, Studer A80, Crystal Dreamline, Transparent Audio Ref XL digital and Ref Gen V power cables, CenterStage footers, Nordost Qkore6' s and QB8's! Digital Audio Forum: DAC, Transports, Digital Processing Forum, 4x20A circuits | Audioquest Niagara 3000 | Paul Hynes SR4T + HDPlex HD500 PSUs -> Music PC w/JCAT XE nic, HQPlayer, Roon, Tidal / Qobuz | HDPlex HD100 PSU -> OCX clock + EtherRegen | Aqua Acoustic Quality LinQ streamer | Aqua Acoustic Quality Formula xHD Rev. - MQA decoding. The MSB Discrete, as I mentioned, came with two power supplies but you can operate it with just one with the supplied doodad. September 6, 2016 in DAC - Digital to Analog Conversion. This latter recording gets played to death at shows, but that doesnt detract from it being a very good tune and a very good recording, though I have been known to take the piss a bit when it gets played for the tenth time in a day at audio events. The USB module is completely electrically isolated and is again a standalone module capable of 32 bit#768kHz, MQA decoding and 8X DSD. Hifi Pig is part of the Big Pig Media LLP group of companies. Im outputting directly to the LAB12 (and later a Krell KST100) power amp and so a digital volume algorithm is used where the digital volume control is left at a relatively high output so as not to encounter loss at lower volume levels. had if for 2 years now. You'll be shocked by how much you lose by going through a separate preamp. Thanks guys! All in all the Discrete DAC is beautiful looking, minimal, easy to set up (its all but plug and play if you turn both the PSUs on) and it feels like a proper bit of audio engineering. It is not hard to audition these DACs in Melbourneand this is your best way to work out your own preference. The To cut a long story short: A burnt in MSB Analog DAC with Power Base demoed side to side to a burnt in DAVE was no challenge for the MSB. An FPGA does not have analog output, in the Chord DACs, the FPGA handles digital processing only, not conversion from digital to analog. If I want to build a complicated system, I won't consider DAVE because for the position of DAC, I can choose from other brands (Totaldac, NADAC, Rockna, Prismsound 8XR etc) at the same price. That is not to say that a preamp doesn't produce value with respect to other sound quality characteristics that may affect the personal appeal of the musical reproduction (e.g., soundstage), or that the extra transparency won't reveal system issues, but there is no question that transparency is higher when going straight to the amps. digital 149728-117859 MSB select II vs all dacs ? The lo-res display also makes menu ]set-up fiddly because it doesn't have enough space to display words. Anyone make that comparison? I understand that audio stores and distribution companies have the opportunity to A/B a significant amount of equipment. My wife said it Supported Formats (Depending on Input) 44.1 kHz to 3.072kHz PCM up to 32 bits 1xDSD, 2xDSD, 4xDSD, 8xDSD Accepts DSD via DoP on all inputs, Digital Inputs 1x RCA Coaxial 1x XLR 1x Word-Sync Out 2x Toslink 2x Isolated slots for optional modules, XLR Outputs Voltage: 3.57 Vrms Maximum Impedance 300 High Gain setting Impedance 150 Low Gain setting. Would love to hear your opinions of which was better and why? and this is borne out in the sound that this DAC brings to the party. A modular I/O card keeps even the discrete DAC flexible, repairable, and upgradeable. Search: Msb Discrete Dac Vs Chord Dave. There is the option to add a streaming module to the Discrete and if I was in the market for a digital streaming solution, then this is where I would be going. us, over a 2 day test period come to the exact same conclusion. However, there are also products that manage to straddle both sides of the electric fence (whilst being careful not to electrocute their nether regions) and give us a tremendously enjoyable reproduction of a recording whilst remaining true to the source material. Less experience with Dave on DSD, plus Rob claims to no longer decimate. "Im not sure if there are algorithms that can add high-frequency information that wasnt captured in the original sampled result". To be 100% honest we have A/B tested most of the dacs mentioned Some silly sausage plugged a white power cable into a black device. 2001-2023 Head-Fi.org. Conversely, you could spend a lot more and not gain a great deal in real terms. Thank you, Mike. In terms of sound quality, it's the best digital front end I . But dont take our word for it. II cannot do anything but award this DAC our highest award, but that award goes with the caveats that it should be used directly into an amplifier and that Id like to have had the options for analogue inputs. Still, it's the way I prefer at this stage. The BADA Ref is a great DAC and I understand the new version takes it to even another level. I would have loved if you heard them in the same system for a direct comparison. Sit back and be immersed. I've had some excellent preamps in my system (Dartzeel, Absolare, Robert Koda, Kondo). So take it for what it is. I know it is a standard talking point by some to suggest that Chord DACs aren't as good with DSD as PCM. Its a clever thing meaning that their products are repairable and upgradeable for example, you can have a card that is set up for single-ended outputs or balanced XLR outputs (for review we have the balanced version). It is bested easily by DACs at $150. Elevator Pitch Review: Built in America, the MSB Discrete is a modular DAC that also acts as a preamplfier, though, as supplied, it has no analogue inputs. Anyway, the MSB Discrete is a machine that I consider to be highly resolving and a true HiFi product with regard to the definition I quoted above. The next module is the display which is a cool and easy-to-read LED that is slaved to the audio clock. Looks like your budget goes up to ~$20k? At MSB, we believe excellence is a promise worth keeping. Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers, A healthy approach to understanding measurements, After being asked for the 308th time, Merv lists top 5 headphones, $1000 to the first to design a headamp using discrete components with better measurements than Magni 3+, http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f6-dac-digital-analog-conversion/chord-dave-29757/#post579518, (You must log in or sign up to reply here.). November 11, 2020 in Digital Sources, DACs, and Computer Audio. Equipped with high-visibility and a wide viewing angle, the display is both easy-to-read and stunning, exhibiting our love for intuitive features. You already have a very top tier DAC. MSB thrives off the innovation required to meet consumer demands. Ok, I looked a prat but it proves that the separate PSUs are actually doing something rather than being there for show, though they do look rather cool in themselves. The DAC comes equipped with a single power supply, but can be augmented with a second discrete power supply to enable optimized power isolation between all major components. I can only comment on the Emm labs, if u can get a DA2 I think you will be happy "An audiophile is only done when they go to the great brick and mortar store in the sky" Ron Resnick Everyone hears differentlyI heard the Dave with the Blu and I prefer it without it. JavaScript is disabled. 2 are upscalers , not upsamplers. what Im saying is that comparing dacs also must take into account of all the interface advantages of each particular dac. Roon Endpoint How r they comparing to the MSB Select 2 and Trinity? The MSB Discrete DAC is an American made Digital to Analogue Converter costing 11,000 plus an extra 1650 for the second external power supply. Firstly, that was a very impressive list of high end components you have listened to. You'd expect Audiosanctuary to understand what a gutless amp sounds like, and at least put a headphone amp in front of that DAVE, if they wanted to sell people either the DAVE or the headphones. recent murders in colorado springs 2021,